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Agnostics are much easier to talk to about this because, unlike atheists who don't believe in God at all, agnostics just don't believe the existance of God can be proven or disproven. I would like to stress that the question behind this conversation was NOT whether God existed or not. In fact, that is besides the point. The point of this discussion was that "if" God did exist and you had to live by a certain set of morals and values and did not accept the gift offered to you that would save you from the consequences that go with breaking those morals and guidelines(which, in the case, that gift was Jesus Christ being beaten and crucified on a cross for your sin), would you deserve those consequences? And in Christianity, the ultimate consequence is Hell. But, the ultimate reward is eternal life through Jesus Christ.
Now,here we go.
Me-"Do you think you're a good person?"
Her-"Sure, I consider myself a good person."
Me-" Well, may I ask you a few questions to see if that's true? And, just to be fair,I will pose these same questions to myself."
Her-"sure, why not?"
Me- "Have you ever told a lie?"
Her response- "sure,who hasnt?"
Me- "So have I. So,what does that make us?"
Her response- "liars”
Me- "have you ever stolen anything?even the smallest little thing?"
Her response- "yes".
Me-"Me too. So,what does that make us?"
Her response-"theives"
Me- "Have you ever used God's name in vain?" (and that means using His name as a cuss word.)
Her response- "sure. Every once in a while"
Me-"well that is called blasphemy. I'm guilty of that too.".
Me- "Have you ever looked at a person with lust?”
Her response- "yea."
Me- "well,God says that when you look at someone with lust, you have already committed adultery with them in your heart. So,By our own admission(I didn't accuse you of anything.You admitted to all this yourself and so did I)-we are lying,theiving,blasphemous,adulterers at heart. So, do you still think you are a good person?"
Her- "Well, if you put it in those terms. I suppose not. But, wait, some of those are really minor faults. We're not bad people if we slip every once in a while."
ME--" Well, who is to say which fault is greater than another? are you measuring sin by your own standards, the standards of man or the standards of God? In God's eyes all sin is equal. No sin is lessor or greater than the other. But, that is not necessarily a bad thing. It just means that just as every sin is equal, every sin is equally forgivable. As terrible as murder is, even that is forgivable in the eyes of God. According to the bible, the only unforgivable sin is blasphemy against the Holy Spirit.- Which means, knowingly and willingly rejecting the Holy Spirit. That God is something cannot forgive. Again, As I am telling you all this, please Keep in mind that I am not judging you. Everything we have just discussed is by your own admission. And I have done these same things. So,I myself, am guilty.
Now,lets just say for arguments sake that you do believe in God. This is a ‘for instance'. After all, all you really have to believe and listen to is your own conscience. Whether you call it "God" or whatever. IF God were to judge you by the Ten commandments(like the ones I just mentioned-which are pretty much standard morals and values that everyone should live by whether they believe in God or not) would you be innocent or guilty?I dont think anyone could say they would be innocent. So,based on that,do you think you would deserve to go to heaven(the ultimate reward) or hell( the ultimate punishment)?also keep in mind that Hell is not necessarily all 'fire and brimstone'. Hell is eternal separation from God and His love(and His protection) without which, we would all suffer tremendous agony. Therefor "Hell" is a place of eternal agony and torment”
Her response- "well,hell probably. But, I don't believe my God would punish me that way"
Me-“ Alright,now, again, what you're doing there is choosing or creating a god or religion that suits your own standards and lifestyle. God calls that 'Idolatry'. Which is another commandment -"thou shall not have any other gods before Me".I hope this all Helps.Once again,I am not trying to judge you in any way( I am held to these same standards as I just mentioned.So if I am judging you,I bring judgement on myself).I am just giving you an idea of how Christianity works and something to think about. And, I know God's judgement may seem harsh by today's standards of morals and values. However,if you carefully examine everything we've talked about with an honest heart, you will see just how fair and just God's judgement is. (and,let's face it-todays standards of morals and values are so pathetically low, they are nearly non-exsistant)And God's rewards for obeying His commandments far out-weigh His punishments for breaking them.
Even though I dont know you personally,I care about you(If I didnt,I would not have taken all this time to discuss this). And I care about your eternal destiny.You have already considered the fact that I may be wrong. But,just this once,consider that I might be right. Because if your right and I AM wrong,you really have nothing to lose.However,If I am right and you are wrong,that means you have everything to lose.And I dont want you to suffer the consequences of what I am talking about. Remember,God gave everyone a way out-All we gotta do is believe and accept what Jesus did on the cross. Once you've done that, God says "I will cast your sins as far as the east is to the west and will remember them no more." But, that doesn't give you a free pass to keep on living the same life you were before. You have to play your part in your own salvation.Does this mean you can never sin or fall again and if you do, your going to hell?Absolutely not. All it means is that you must be mindful of the things you do and TRY your best not to fall again. If you do, you have the assurance to know that you can always go to God and He will forgive you.That is IF you go to Him for forgiveness. God doesn't ask for perfection. All he asks for is humility-which means humbling yourself and admitting what you did was wrong and asking for forgiveness:-")
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(This conversation was not meant to start a debate or win a battle.It wasn't even mean't to convert the person right then and there. All this conversationwas mean't to do is leave the person with something to think about. When you do that, the person will examine his or her own life and make up their own mind. Which is what effectual ministering is meant to do. Not cram God down anyone's throat. Some may feel that that's what I did here. However,she didn't. A few days later, she came back to me and said that, after giving our conversation a lot of thought and digging deeper into Christianity on her own, she gave her heart to God.That was the ultimate goal.)
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