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Emanon Eranatos's blog: "RANDOM STUFF!!"

created on 10/18/2006  |  http://fubar.com/random-stuff/b15189  |  2 followers

Blogging Buffoon Activated

 

Here is her original message, nothing has been altered, and since at the end she said to post my own blog for my response

You are attacking what is obviously an emotional (NOT RELIGIOUS OR BIGOTED) point of view for me. As for "politicizing" this issue, even those FOR it are doing so.

"Rejecting this has become like rejecting Islam itself," said Ahmad Moussalli, a professor of Islamic Studies at the American University of Beirut. "The United States has historically been distinguished by its tolerance, whereas Europe, France, Belgium and Holland have been among those who have rejected the symbolism of Islam. Embracing it will be positively viewed in the Islamic world."

So a religious faction is asking us to publicly embrace their motion to build in what many consider sacred ground as a political motion to gain their positive regard? Excuse me if there seems to be a veiled threat behind Moussalli's words. "Not embracing it will be negatively viewed in the Islamic world, and youmay meet with negative consequences." That's what I hear. And maybe that's not what is said, but that's the intonation many Americans.... be they Christians, Jews, Muslims, Atheists, etc are hearing.

If the Muslims are not doing this for any political motive, and they are as peaceful and sensitive as they claim to be, then why is it they won't even consider having a meeting with Governor Patterson when he has offered to broker a new location for them? The possibility of building this park ANYWHERE else is reprehensible, reproachable, and unthinkable in their eyes. Why is that? It's not like anyone is saying "get out of New York." That's exactly what they are NOT saying. What is being said is "In light of the past, in light of those who still grieve and mourn every day of their lives, can you please show some compassion and sensitivity to those who this is impacting very strongly, and move it to another location?"

"Project organizers denied there was any consideration being given to moving the mosque. A written statement from the Cordoba Initiative, the group pushing to build the Islamic center in lower Manhattan, said no meetings have been scheduled between Imam Feisel Abdul Rauf and Paterson, "nor have there been any communications between the offices of Cordoba Initiative and the governor."

After a similar report appeared Monday in an Israeli newspaper, Sharif El-Gamal of SoHo Properties, which owns the property at Park 51, said it's absolutely wrong to suggest that the site is being abandoned.

"No. No. No," El-Gamal said.

"The reports that we may be abandoning the project are completely incorrect. We are committed to our plans of building Park 51 to serve the community of lower Manhattan. Our mission is one of peace, understanding and tolerance," he said." -Ground Zero Mosque Developers Deny Talk of Relocation

Published August 18, 2010

| FoxNews.com

This should not be an emotional weight-lifting competition. It should not be a political power struggle. If there is a mosque already within 8 blocks of the site, what is the need for another? The building of this mosque has been compared to erecting neo nazi symbolism near holocaust sites. While you may recoil in protest and spout "You can't compare the two," that's precisely the issue at hand. No neo-nazi today persecuted the Jews in WWII, yet they would most certainly be held responsible for it if they were to tout the Nazi symbolism in the face of the tragedies.

Make no mistake, the Ground Zero Mosque is a symbol to the Islamic world and to Mecca where there is no religious freedom, it is a symbol to what they accomplished on 911. The man pushing it, Imam Rauf, does not believe Hamas is a terrorist group and blames America for 911. If Islam is a religion of peace, why are there no Christian churches in Saudia Arabia? And why, in this country, do we use federal money to build mosques yet a teacher in a public school cannot wear a cross out side of their shirts. Why is Christmas now a Winter Holiday, why are there no nativity scenes in the Whitehouse, why are monuments that stood for 60 years be taken down because they make reference to the bible or Christianity. Why is the 10 Commandments, the basis of our laws, removed from court houses. Why is private prayer in public places not allowed yet we fund foot washing basins in public schools for muslims. It is a wonder when liberals all of a sudden remember the other half of the First Ammendment when it comes to the religion of Islam but convienently skipped over when it comes to Christianity.

Now I'm not preaching for any religion, but if we are so politically opposed to allowing any form of religion in our schools, we must take into account that there is a very strong political hypocrisy in offering ANY monetary aid to the funding of ANY religious structure. I personally don't think any religion should be practiced in the schools as part of the school, but at the same time, provision must be made for ALL those who CHOOSE to do so. We cannot provide muslim wash basins without providing for all others.


It's not about this being an election year. I'm not sure where you get that info from, but the majority of this controversy is not being publicly aired. You have to dig for the information. The Siena College poll showed 63 percent of New York voters surveyed oppose the project, with 27 percent supporting it. That compares with 64 percent opposed and 28 percent in favor two weeks earlier.
I promise you, that 63% is not a bunch of self-righteous hypocrites screaming out with a voice of narrow-minded bigotry.

As for you bringing up how we are denying Muslims their "Constitutional Rights," you had better read that again. The Constitution does not guarantee freedom of religion. The 1st Amendment says "Congress shall make no law", it does not say "The State of New York shall make no law". So while Congress can not establish an official national religion, any state can establish an official state religion. In fact, after the Constitution was ratified several states still had official state religions. Eventually they decided to do away with them, but the Constitution did not and does not require them to do so. In order to "respect" the Constitution you have to READ it and UNDERSTAND it. Not to mention, the SITE of a religious building is not covered by the constitution.

Two imams (spiritual leaders) of the Islamic Cultural Center have made controversial statements.

The first, Sheik Muhammad Gemeaha, said in an interview that "only the Jews" were capable of the September 11 attacks and "if it became known to the American people, they would have done to Jews what Hitler did." He also stated that as "Allah described it," Jews "disseminate corruption in the land" and are responsible for the spread of "heresy, homosexuality, alcoholism, and drugs."
In further controversial statements, Gemeaha's replacement, Omar Saleem Abu-Namous, condemned the September 11 attacks, but said there wasn't "conclusive evidence" that Muslims were responsible. Bob Beckel, a supporter of the Mosque construction, sneered, "At some point... New York is going to have to get over 9/11!"

Is that what this is? If you slap us in the face hard enough, we are just going to "get over" what has been done and embrace those who stand in our faces with very thinly veiled hostility and speak smooth, glib words with superficial charm?

There is:
No sensitivity for the families of 9/11 victims
No sensitivity for the first responders whose painful memories are as vivid as last night's nightmare
No sensitivity for New Yorkers who searched for loved ones in the rubble of 9/11
No sensitivity for the millions of Americans who sat glued to their televisions in shocked horror as Twin Towers crumpled, as hijackers crashed a third airliner into the Pentagon, as another plane crashed in a field in Pennsylvania after brave passengers and flight crew attempted to retake the planes
No sensitivity for all of the troops who have died to protect the freedoms of Americans and Muslims all over the globe
No sensitivity to a combined death toll of near 3000 civilians, including nationals of over 70 countries

There is no sensitivity to any of this. Have we become so politicized that we have lost our humanity? Are we simply to become automated robots and go through life with an uncaring, unfeeling attitude and numb ourselves to the horrors we have faced and the aftermath that follows? This is still part of the aftermath. We are still engaged in a war that started on September 11th. I think this is neither the right time, nor the right place for the construction of the Park 51 project or the Mosque. And if I were so wrong about the way I feel, there wouldn't be so many others on a global level who are screaming out with the same outrage I feel.

Now, you may respond to this as you so choose. I am done defending my position to you or anyone else. More than enough has been said, and I am quickly tiring of your desire to debate just to make yourself feel superior. The thought that this doesn't affect you in the slightest makes me cringe and wonder if there is any depth to your humanity. Your neglect in understanding the response and natural emotional reaction from so many in the country is almost criminally negligent from a hard look at things with regards to moral and ethical law. Are politics more important than people? Is a perceived "need" to prove how tolerant we are really so vital that we will swallow our fundamental, natural, human emotions and fake a smile through the tears as we blindly attempt to embrace that which we have grown to hate? And it's not that we hate the religion. We hate the "we're going to do this, whether you like it or not" attitude. We hate the "We're about to become the biggest religion in the world, so get used to us" attitude that has been taken. It's the "I'm better than you, my god is better than you, and there's nothing you can do to stop this" concept that has so many people outraged. I'm not saying christianity is any better. More people have been killed in the name of Christianity than any other religion. However, it appears Islamic extremists are trying just as hard to catch up to that distinction as the faith itself is trying to surpass Christianity in numbers.

This blog was posted to express my own outrage at something so intensly painful for me. It is most certainly NOT here for you to spout off about your own agenda, although I have not stopped anyone from doing so. At this point, I would like to ask you to post your own blog if you have anything else to say, as I'm disgusted with the turn of events that have taken place here.

“added after”
By the way.... just an FYI... for those saying this is not hallowed ground and the site of the new mosque has nothing to do with the WTC attacks... the site of the new Mosque was originally a store that was rendered useless after being damaged by the debris from the Trade Centers. In my opinion, if the ground was touched by the desecration of the attacks, it is hallowed ground and needs to be respected as such.



Here is my response, since I am rather long winded it is just over six pages..so read if you want...

I attacked no one, I did address the blog and the words therein, since the words therein are not written by you, how could I then be in attack of you?

Now, I am asking you, since you posted the blog, with the ending of "HOW LONG ARE WE GOING TO LAY DOWN AND LET THEM WALK ON US?" Who is this "them"? Who is this imaginary enemy that will take the place of this... them?

But it is a post of just that, I mean if you listen to her statements, if you see her other post on her blogs, if you see her on fox news and things of that nature, she makes no secret of her not being a fan at all of Islam, and most of her conservative followers know that she is completely anti Islam. So... like many of the partisan puppets and news people who have taken a side on this, she has an agenda... Okay, he lost people, so did the people who want the build the mosque or are in favor of it, one's lost doesn't trump the lost of another.

You say not religious or bigoted, once again, have you seen her other works, simply because this piece may not be as blunt as her other pieces she is quite bigoted. Actually no, before the big news coverage of building it, no one was really talking about, but once it is on the news everyday, then they have to take a side.

Okay? What am I to get from his quote? That a Muslim man feels that not allowing them to build a mosque just because they are Muslims feels like they are rejecting Islam…well... yea. So he made a statement and then praised America for it being generally historically tolerant as it pertained to religion.

Oh yes a religious faction that does not want you to hate their religion... what exactly was the point of that sentence of them wanting us to embrace their religion? Of course they do, no more than Christians want us to embrace Christianity, and Jews want us to embrace to their religion, embrace merely means to include as apart of our life, to stop demonizing it and to stop trying to connect "Islam" attempting to equate it with terrorist, so what is wrong with them wanting us to embrace them?

I don't get the whole sacred ground, okay maybe I could grasp the whole sacred ground if they were building it at ground zero, and it is nearly three blocks away, so where does this "sacred ground" ends?

*face palms* yes it is a threat to say if you mistreat Muslims here, than other Muslims may not be so open to embrace you world wide.... I mean really... I am just glad I am not one of these "many".

Why should they? They own the land; they have their mosque 11 blocks away, governor Patterson already said that the location he would pick out will not be in the same zone as the one they are currently in since as you might have imagined there are not plenty of large open places that are not already spoken for. So why should they, after spending so much money on a piece of land, then simply move when it is... a perfect location with their mosque being only blocks away.

I love this whole why don't they, the question isn't why don't they, the question is, why should they?

Yet the question still remains, how close is too close, you have some people who want it more than a mile away, some want it even further, why should they have to move when their mosque is just a short 7 block walk, and there is no other place within 7 blocks large enough lot for their mosque...

So? The Imam has said for quite some time, that given the close proximity it is to his mosque he has 11 blocks away from ground zero, [7 blocks from the community center] that there is no other places in the surrounding that could accommodate such a building. For this he has made it clear that he is not moving, nor should he.

...okay... he always said he had no plans of moving, he has not changed his words in months, so... it is not secret that there were never any plans of relocation.

*oy vey* are you actually comparing this mosque to Nazis. Why should they not have another mosque? Question for you, there are over 6,000 churches in NYC, several within this same are, so what use of them wanting them build another church a block away? There are over 1,000 synangogues in NYC alone, so what good if a Rabbi want to build another Synagogue?...there are just over 100 mosques in NYC, and NYC has a continuously growing muslim population, so they want to build yet another mosque, and another and another to keep accommodating the fastest growing modern religion, good for them.

The fallacy in your argument is the Nazis are a racist political groups who wanted the destruction of all Jews, Muslims, Blacks, atheists, gays, gypsies, soviet citizens, socialist, communist, cripples etc, Muslims are a religion, who for a very large majority are a very peaceful people. So are we to demonize and denigrate an entire people because of fundamentalist in that religion?

Okay? What exactly does that have to do with American citizens? Of course you have people in the Middle East, fundamentalist, who see the attacks as a great win for them, that has nothing to do with American Muslims and their wanting to build a mosque.

I heard his quotes, and what he said, what he said was that America has to take some responsibility for it. Do we not? If you look at the history of why Al Qaeda hates us in the first place, it is our fault, so I am only guessing since only he knows what he means, yet could this not be what he meant? That because of our past with Al Qaeda and us starting off as allies when we wanted to topple saddam, and all that went down after that, that that is what could be the responsibility we must take for the rival between us?

*face palms* I love the attempting to connect a theocracy type country in the east, with a democratic country as America. Do tell us what exactly is the connection between there being no churches in Saudi Arabia and building mosque here?

What is the difference, hm; same way I suppose was the difference under queen Mary of England. They are not a democracy; they are a monarchy, theocracy of sorts where Islam is the religion the king has chosen for his kingdom. But if you wish to speak of the kindness of it, let us not forget that while he opposed them opening up a church inside his kingdom, he did fully support and they did build a catholic church several years ago right outside the border.

Same reason we use federal moneys to build churches and synagogues... are mosques not awarded the same treatment as these two?

REALLY? Since when? When I went to public schools several of the teachers wore crosses, and no one had any problem with it at all. Now if some small town or state has an issue with a teacher wearing a cross, surely it is not because some Muslim said we feel uncomfortable with a Christian teaching his child.

To be quite honest I had to look this up, though what I find it is not just crosses as you mentioned, they were even trying to take out turbans, yarmulkes, head scarves and all types of religious clothing, so it is not just Christians being targeted... and it also said the teachers will more than likely win their case against the school board. So good for ALL OF THE religious teachers... not as if one religion was just being targeted but all of them.

Well if you mean why have some stores stop saying Christmas and prefer to use happy holidays, maybe because they understand not everyone is Christian and celebrate Christmas? Maybe they have woken up that there are actual beliefs in this country that are not Christian, muslim, Jews, Wiccan/pagan, satanic, etc, who do not celebrate "Christmas"...so they actually want all of them to feel welcomed, I mean how dare they not just cater to one particular belief...

No one is telling the stores, YOU CAN'T SAY MERRY CHRISTMAS OR YOU WILL BE FINED... but if the owners of the store want everyone to be cool and feel welcomed, then good for them.

Why do we need a nativity scene at the white house? They had a huge Christmas tree wasn't that enough? Obama made no secret that he was raised by an atheist mother, and not OVERLY religious grandparents, so maybe his mother did not celebrate Christmas. Could that be why? Is a nativity scene so important?

...maybe because we have a separation of church and state, could that be why?

Well... our laws are based on several things mostly common sense things, I mean doesn't take a genius to say don't kill, don't steal, etc. the majority of the ten commandments are not in our laws. The first isn't, the second isn't, the third isn't, the fourth isn't, the fifth isn't, the sixth is, the seventh was and is not any more, the eight is, nine is somewhat as it pertains to witness testimony, and ten isn't. So of these Ten Commandments, only three are apart of the law hm. If we take murder and stealing which were laws in societies that predate the ten commandments, [well giving the benefit of the doubt of the ninth commandment] that leaves just one out of ten .

Not to mention several of the founding fathers were deist and had no use for the bible...one as far as I know had a deep hatred of religion and the bible... so moving on.

What private prayer in public places, and foot basins in public schools? I googled this and it was a college, not a PS public school. While the school like most college accept anyone, it is still private property. I see nothing in this same school installing the foot basins saying that Christians cannot pray...maybe you know something about these colleges that are not in their pages, they seem to be trying to be respectful of all faiths...

Lmao @ liberals, I knew there was a reason for all these questions, question for you, what does "liberals" have to do with colleges wanting to respect all religions, including their Christian students? What "liberal" has said he is preferable over Islam than Christianity? What "liberal" has spoke of limiting the rights of Christians and expanding that of Muslims, do tell me what "liberal". By liberal I mean someone of importance, not just some average joe. What "other half" of the first amendment? hm

*face palms*... most of the founding fathers were liberals, most of the civil rights workers were Christians and liberals, ..most liberals in America are Christian.. but yes, it is a big evil liberal conspiracy against christianity..

You seem to be preaching for a religion, but okay. You cannot compare what one does as it pertains to religion in public schools, vs what they do in college. College schools are considered private property and not public property, the funny thing, the school I saw installing the foot basins for their muslim students was a Catholic College, you are not saying that catholic colleges are anti Christian now are you?... But I also see other colleges are follwing them, non religious or rather not religiously based colleges, but if they want to allow all of their students free practice of their faith, good for them.

What others? Christians do not have any stipulation that I know of that they must wash before prayer do they? As far as I know, neither do Jews, [maybe they do, I said as far as I know] yet islam, before prayer you MUST cleanse yourself, it is apart of their religious practices, so if a school wishes to help students practice their faith freely, I say good for that school.

*big face palms* it is not about election? They knew about this mosque/community since last years, do you honestly thing they held it to right before elections if it had not been about the votes? "but the majority of this controversy is not being publicly aired" WHAT? It is on every news station every night, especially on the national news stations like Fox, CNN, MSNBC etc, it is a big story on these, so it is very much publicly aired. Dig for information? Fox news airs the imam quotes like every day...

Okay? I am well aware that the majority of people are opposed to it, ... am I to side with a majority  when I do not agree with them?

I just LOVE how you cut the rest of that line off "Congress shall make no law"... there is more to it than that.. now here is the full line of that text  "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..." is the full line. So yes, the congress, and state shall not prohibit the free practice of ones beliefs.

Actually it cannot, the state laws are superseded by the federal law, i.e. the constitution. Such as in several southern state constitutions [as I am sure you know each state has its own constitution, and then there is the federal one which supersedes them all].. there are clauses in several state constitutions saying a person holding office must believe in god, and they tried to impeach an atheist in one southern state because of their constitution, yet the federal constitution supersedes the states constitution and as such a state cannot do something which goes against the very fabric of the federal constitution.

"In order to "respect" the Constitution you have to READ it and UNDERSTAND it. Not to mention, the SITE of a religious building is not covered by the constitution."
I do understand it, just like you cut off the most important part of the first amendment as it pertained to religion, they are also are not allowed to prohibit the free practice of any religion, so that goes along with buildings, ... and anything else in according with the practice thereof. So since I did READ and UNDERSTAND it as you so capitalizingly [my own word] put it, it still holds true.

Okay? I am pretty sure there was something behind their tirades you were putting.

*FACE PALMS!!!!*

Okay let me clear this major fallacy up for you, sheikh Muhammad was apart of "A" Islamic center on upper east side, he made these statements not long after september 11th, and left NYC, and had no more participation with that mosque. He was not connected with "the islamic cultural center" that is being built now.... in fact as far as the authorities know he has never returned to NYC since he left.

Oh you mean his replacement who also has nothing to do with the mosque/Community center being built? Who runs a mosque which is overseen by United Nations Ambassadors ...

"Bob Beckel, a supporter of the Mosque construction, sneered, "At some point... New York is going to have to get over 9/11!""

Um okay? What is wrong with saying at some point NY is going to have to get over 9/11. He is entitled to say that is he not? I mean it is not as bad as saying he hates 9/11 families ..as another fox news guy did.... but okay moving on.

They slapped you in the face by having an opinion different from yours? This is America, freedom of speech is not just for the speech you happen to agree with.

Let us go through your there is list...

"No sensitivity for the families of 9/11 victims"
What about the 9/11 families who support the mosque? Who understand not all Muslims attacked us and all should not have to pay for it.

"No sensitivity for the first responders whose painful memories are as vivid as last night's nightmare"
Okay? Once again, what did these Muslims have to do with the attack, nothing.

"No sensitivity for New Yorkers who searched for loved ones in the rubble of 9/11"
Some of those thousands that support the mosque are the family members of people who were searched for, as well as one of the muslim woman on the board of directors lost her son in the WTC center...

"No sensitivity for the millions of Americans who sat glued to their televisions in shocked horror as Twin Towers crumpled"
So yes, we demonize and make all Muslims pay for the acts of a few... I mean that is the American way right?

", as hijackers crashed a third airliner into the Pentagon, as another plane crashed in a field in Pennsylvania after brave passengers and flight crew attempted to retake the planes"
...still waiting on some connection to these Muslims.

"No sensitivity for all of the troops who have died to protect the freedoms of Americans and Muslims all over the globe"
Are they not also dying for the freedoms of MUSLIM AMERICANS, for their freedom to also practice their faith and such as they see fit.

"No sensitivity to a combined death toll of near 3000 civilians, including nationals of over 70 countries"
You say no sensitivity, an Imam who is putting a small shrine in the community center to remember 9/11 victims, who has been known for reaching out with people of all faiths.

Is it about humanity? If it is then where is it? We expect them to just appease us, for something they had nothing to do it. When we keep comparing them to a group who hates and kills them [Al Qaeda], when every true statement spoken by the imam is taken as some personal American attack, because he has an opinion that people may not want to hear.

If not now, then when? How long will be okay for the "right time", how far away as I have asked several times is far enough? There is a group of people in FL protesting a group of Muslims building a mosque there, how far is too far for it to be good enough?

lmao @ make myself feel superior. You put forth a premise of another, I disagreed with it, I commented my feelings on said premise, if such a thing was meant to make me seem superior, a lot more could have been done.

Oh how I love the little telling me about me, that was great, it does affect me, yet unlike those of the same ilk as many, I am not willing to demonize a whole people for something they had nothing to do with, I am not the one who shall say, because Muslims attacked us, and you are Muslims we want you to move your center as far away as possible so there is no chance of seeing it at ground zero.. we understand that those who attacked us are also your enemies and have been killing your people in the middle east for years, but for America.. muslim is muslim so you must go... no I shall not be that voice to lump all of similars and forget the differences.

"Are politics more important than people? "
What people? You mean those Americans who had nothing to do with the attack? Whose people have been getting murdered by Al Qaeda for years? You mean I am to simply join the mob in protest and not care for that which is demonize without reason?...

You may feel how you want, no one is saying you may not feel how you want, nor is anyone saying that ones wants should be that which dictates the law and a people.

... hate, that is the problem, people have grown to hate islam, not for anything islam as a whole has done, not for anything islam as a whole has abolished, but ..for the few fundamentalist people within that religion.

Okay, so they are the fastest growing religion in the world, any religion in history who has held such a thing has been arrogantly proud... it is nothing new.

Um, "My god is better than you", um, Muslims, Jews and Christians all admit they worship the same god, they just worship him differently... or do you mean better than you as in people, if that is the case then that is all religions...

Eh, when you have Christians in Africa who have killed about 30-50K kids as of this year who believe they are possessed by the devil... the number of Christian casualties are still growing.. Though it is the extremist on both sides that make a faith look bad.

Are we judge these Muslims for what some middle eastern extremist do? Are we to judge Christians for what those extremist Christians are doing in Africa?

...well if we must be fair, it was that Pamela Geller's blog of rhetoric which was reposted, which knowing of her anti-islam and proud, I have issues with such and countered the blog.

My own agenda... well I guess I do have one, to stop the lumping of whole people together for no other reason than they happen to be the same faith.

I mean if we start taking the smallest of similarities and grouping all who may share the say belief or disbelief then... hm all Muslims are all Idi Amin, Catholics/Christians are all Hitler, all atheist are Stalin, Mao....all Jews are like Gush Emunim Underground [couldn't find any modern jewish mass killing dictators so used a jewish terrorist group]


...as per the last part, I will just say, if it good enough for a strip joint, then it is good enough for an islamic community center or any other religious type building.

 

Okay if you do not want to read all of the debate I shall leave this bottom section for you lazy fuckers :P

My doctor called me and said it has been five years since I  had a check up, I said..yea and?... he wants me to come in.. so should I go?

Second Situation, yesterday someone called me anti-American for saying that America is not the greatest country in the world? Has truth become bad in this country? Just because you are the richest and strongest that does not make you the best... for fucks sake you are not even the most democratic of countries...

Okay, in every one of babyjesus's blog, I ask for a big box of porn, he always approves the comment, do you think I will get my porn? Hm, haha.

*looks at bottom picture* I have watched V for Vendetta at least 20 times in the past week hm, I think I have issues.

Okay Comrades, that is all.

But if you did read the debate, ... do voice your opinion.

 

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